By John Roberts, Sedona Resident
(March 20, 2019)
My first published letter submitted about Soldiers Pass needs some clarification. This roadway is unsafe as the last message explained and as has been testified to by intelligent commentary and especially in detailed experiences reported by residents often using this road to access town. From the view of an engineering professional in the highways and road building design and construction standpoint the hazard on Soldier pass consists of parking cars too far into and on the paving and in too many cases closing off one of the two traffic lanes completely, almost no shoulders, trees growing up too close to the paving surface, traffic often exceeding the 25mph posted speed limit, poor to very poor line of sight, far too many parked cars every day the count running almost as much as into the 90 to 100 range almost all of them in a reach of less than a mile or a mile and a half. The city’s claim that the road meets safe standards can only be a mistake by them. It just aint so. Nor did just about all of the the 20 or so comments the letter drew agree that it was safe.
In the reaction by comments to the first letter on this road hazard there were no worthwhile engineering nor any intelligent comments offered to oppose the need for corrective steps to make Soldiers Pass safe. And not potentially deadly. The hazardous situation has not changed. But my understanding why the city doesn’t take steps to rid the roadway of these hazards has improved..It is significant that there has yet to be stated any justification for inaction by the city.
This change in understanding the “why” results from a good enlightening visit with Robert Welch a PE and Associate Engineer at Public Works in Sedona city hall. We are fortunate to employ him. Bob is an asset.
Here is what I now better understand about why Soldiers Pass road remains with no city action to make Soldier Pass safe.
The over riding situation is that tourists and residents want to hike the nearby Soldier Pass forest trail. Both have that right. But there’s not anywhere enough forest land parking available at the trail head so parking is done along nearby Soldiers Pass road with hikers walking to the trail head. Co-operation from the USFS for providing more parking at the trail head is not there.
Another factor is the Sedona population consisting of both retired folks and those residents committed to serve the tourist. With this in mind it is easy to understand city manager Justin Clifton reluctant stance not to close down all parking along Soldiers Pass as I last suggested with no parking signs and police patrolling to cite violators. If he did the uproar would be deafening from a good number of citizens.
This dilemma will remain as will the hazard of driving on Soldiers Pass. With no corrective action being taken is it necessary that someone becomes maimed or killed before action to rid the hazards is taken. City hall best take action because after (not if) a tragedy happens to some innocent person the likelihood of a sizeable monetary claim to follow is very much more than a possibility. With all the evidence now accumulating along with professional opinion the persuasiveness of the city case is about a zilch.
It is time to act. Being just lucky is not a good city policy. Nor is having someone killed on our streets.
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20 Comments
Please pardon my changing the subject, John. Are you by chance the John Roberts who allegedly worked for the City at the time the voters approved the wastewater treatment plant?
Several years ago a local Accountant wrote me: “At the time the wastewater treatment plant was approved by the voters, we were told that a portion of the city sales tax revenue would be used to pay for the plant.”
As regards the WW rate structure and financial analysis on next Tuesday’s City Council Agenda (March 26th): Willdan Financial Services recommends transitioning to a water usage-based structure. City staff recommends a gradual elimination of the General Fund subsidy to the Wastewater Fund. I.e., make the wastewater operations pay for itself despite the fact that only approximately 60% of the city area has access to the sewer.
According to next Tuesday’s Agenda Item 8.b., “Future [sewer] rates will be reviewed during the meeting and refined as Council solidifies policy decisions that impact cost.” Shifting more of the wastewater burden onto hard-pressed ratepayers frees up extra millions to facilitate City overspending.
Jean, when the design of the sewers and the plant were under way I was involved in a committee along with Si Birch to advise and suggest. When the sewer bond issue began I hired on to run the information program to get it passed in the sewer district election ( did by 80% ). Since then I have not been that active in the sewer/sewage affairs.
But I am concerned with the very high debt we’ve been saddled with and if this can somehow be reduced.
On the same kind of stage of budget/spending I am also concerned with how much and well spent the city’s SIM program will turn out.
Aren’t we all.
Regarding sewer rates for residents, only 60% of us, we are paying a much higher rate than the hotel/lodging/time share industry. As I wrote in my full page ad in the Red Rock News last August a person living alone pays more for the sewer than tourists in a hotel room. According to a City official this was because
“a resident is here 24/7 every day where as a tourist/tourists might be here for just one or two nights hence the lower rate for the hotel” Also although “back charges” are common in Cities the back charges from our monthly sewer rates to other City departments is enormous especially to the Department of Public Works, up to $300K per year. Haven’t all of us on sewer been led to believe that our monthly fee is for the waster water plant went only for maintenance and to pay down the debt? The latter is not being paid down, just rolled over and still at $22million. We were promised that if we voted for Incorporation sales tax from tourists would subsidize the sewer. The first vote failed so the promise was made by the promoters of Incorporation, one being Mayor Moriarty, if we voted again our sewer rates would never be higher than $25 per month. I now pay for one person $61 per month and rates to be going even higher. Why should Steve Segner who owns El Portal, a 12 room hotel, pay only $500 per month, an example of how the hotel industry is highly favored over residents who are CARRYING THE BURDEN and then just 60% of us. This is scandalous and no one so far on the City Council in the past and present has even spoken out about this and demanded a change. Why are 60% of us paying for three million tourists. Think of the amount of water they are using. This is beyond my understanding..
Joan Shannon: faithfuljoan@earthlink.net
At last Tuesday’s City Council Meeting, out of four options, Council’s direction was to pursue Option D. This assumed 100% of water use October through April and 70% of water use May through September, and combined Residential Standard and Low Flow for the rate. The sales tax subsidy will end in 2026. The Council took these actions with virtually no knowledge and voice of the 60+ percent of us on the sewer.
Sewer fees per Option D: $29.29 Fixed Rate per month plus $4.99 per 1,000 gallons based on water use per month “Debt financing may be considered in the future if the need arises.”
When I asked the City Clerk for copies of the Wastewater Rate Study, Wastewater Financial Plan, and Cost of Service Analysis on March 21st, according to her email reply, cc to the City Attorney: “We do not yet have the documents you requested from Willdan Financial Services. They will present to City council at the March 26th meeting and will have their model on the screen and show the impact of policy decisions. There will be no reports to provide until these policy decisions are made . . .”
Although the City Council received a document re policy decisions, the public did not. We received a woefully inadequate SUMMARY ANALYSIS from the City staff (See March 26th Agenda Item 8.b.) that lacked the rate structure, the revenue projections, etc. As I see it, the Council is pursuing Option D, sewer ratepayers be damned.
By the way, today, according to Sperling’s BEST PLACES: “Compared to the rest of the country, Sedona (zip 86336)’s cost of living is 53.30% higher than the U.S. average.”
I guess it’s par for the course that those of us on the sewer are getting screwed. In my opinion, had we known the sewer rate structure in advance of the Council meeting, it’s likely more than two would have attended the meeting and addressed the Council. The expensive, lousy sewer system’s sewer increases year after year (this year excepted) are reductive. Unlike other cities Sedona’s population is yet to recover from the Great Recession.
We have a similar problem on Chapel road. There was supposed to be a sidewalk adjacent to Chapel Rd. from 179 to the Chapel of the Cross parking lot. This has not happened, so we have pedestrians walking down Chapel to get to the Chapel. This creates a very dangerous situation for the tourists and residents. The city just keeps kicking the can down the road and can’t seem to find the revenue or will to get it done. They raised the sales tax and are going to heavily invest in SIM for the next 10 years, but won’t take care of obvious safety issues NOW.
Right on John. Tourists over residents, the ongoing city motto. I had to call the police the other day as there was no way an emergency vehicle could get down Back O Beyond road. That’s the trailhead for Cathedral. NFS built additional parking. Full. They could build 5 more lots…and they would also be full.
People parking right off the round about at 179 and Back O Beyond road and WALKING down to the trailhead. Back O Beyond road has NO shoulders. It’s narrow, with a drainage ditch on one side and a cliff on the other. If I could post a video I would, but you’ve seen it already.
How about this for nuts…posted. NO PEDESTRIAN ACCESS. From the airport overlook to the airport saddle. BARELY enough room for two way traffic on airport road but people walking over rocks in the drainage ditch.
Someone’s going to die or be seriously injured.
And the city is playing in uptown with $3.6 million.
You’re not going to fix this unless you close ALL trailhead parking lots and establish a shuttle system, like the Grand Canyon does on the west rim. In tourist season. Take bed taxes and fund it.
Not rocket science
But that takes leadership.
Mike S
Oh come on Mike..
You said “there no way an energy vechile could get thru”.
How disingenuous…… If you had your way there would be no emergency vechiles in town. Your cohorts don’t want to spend “ your hard earned tax dollars” on something as silly as that.
Oh yes shuttles to the trail head. Wasn’t that something that Sedona becoming a Nat Monument would of provided.. You and your tea party group were agaisnt that also. What did you call it… a government LAND GRAB if i remember correctly. Hmmmm
I guess you have no idea what your talking about.
On a side note. For you and your tea party clan who were so agaisnt the LAND GRAB in Sedona, you sure don’t care about the generational ranchers down in Texas whom are threatened to have thier land seized to build a wall. Your TeaParty are good with that aye. You are a hypocrite and speak out of both sides of your mouth.
I thank God ypu and your disrespectful BS artists came in last in the Fire board election nor did any thing on the ballot you supported win.
Mike you built on a ded end and narrow road next to the one of the biggest tourist attraction in the Sedona and now you’re crying the blues. You should’ve done your homework, did you think that in 20 years people would stop having children, Phoenix wouldn’t grow, and Sedona wouldn’t have more visitors.? Sedona is recognized as one of the most beautiful places in the world and employees 10,000 people. Mike wants it all to stop and go away and be just like the old days the good all days Mike there are literally thousands and tourist towns in America and at this moment they have bumper to bumper traffic, we live in a successful beautiful town learn to live with it or get on your plane and fly someplace else.
Mike I have a place up the canyon and it takes me an hour to an hour and 15 minutes to get back to sedona in the afternoon and it has for years and it’s worth it ,.
Another Steve Segner ??
Now, when Mike Schroeder’s comments are posted we also get to hear from a Tom Jones besides the regular tirade from Steve Segner. They both criticize Mike with almost identical compositions. Both are incoherent and disparaging reactions to Mike for his comments. Way off base in all cases as they struggle to present a sophisticated demeanor. It”s almost possible that cloning is going on in a clock work like fashion.
Our local media posts are usually intelligent interchanges of different opinions on issues. Neither Jones nor Segner ever really gets anywhere close to this in their blasts of Mike.
Maybe they’ll mend their ways.
@John Roberts
Are you the same John Roberts that has “reported” on meetings in the past without ever attending the meetings your “reporting” on?
I did a little search of your name for John Roberts in Sedona and it ain’t a very glowing search result. Perhaps you have “mended” your way. Hope so.
Segner, you make stuff up. I didn’t build on a dead end loop. I don’t live on Back O Beyond road. So everything you said is BS and not worth the time for anyone to read.
The Grand Canyon figured it out. But you prefer shooting your mouth off rather than offer solutions. I don’t really care how long it takes you to get home. You’re not even a Sedona resident.
Tom Jones. Never heard of you. Are you Segner’s twin? Rehashing the two failed Natonal Monuments isn’t happening here. Thank god.
The post was and is a serious issue stated by John Roberts. Apparently Segner and Jones don’t think so. Suggest you get out more since neither of you really care about the residents of Sedona or the safety of our tourist guests.
It’s interesting when you respond to Mike’s comment you get his tea party website first, so question Mike am I wrong or was last election the first time you voted in 20 years in the Sedona election, and only when you ran for the fire board which by the way you Lost big. and you never answered my question Mike you built a house next to one of the most photographed places in the world and you have the audacity to complain about traffic what is that about are we supposed to feel sorry for you . The cities sedona in motion plan is to benefit the majority not the minority like you it’s to get traffic moving through the canyon were thousands of people live you’ll just have to wait your turn and by the way 179 screwup is partly your fault and we all know it it . Mike regarding your comment I don’t even live in Sedona I think if you were to check with the state government you find out you’re wrong And I voted in the in every election in the last 20 years unlike you.
Why is it that both Jones and Segner always only attack the messenger, Mike Schroeder, and ignore the real message ?
Getting back to what started this string of comments – the unsafe driving conditions existing on Soldiers Pass road — has installing post and steel cable along the roads edge to prevent cars from parking at all been in consideration to make the road safe in that manner. This in combination with the following makes sense to me.
Mike Shroeder reminded us how the Grand Canyon handled pedestrian safety and that would be for us to use shuttle service to the trail head with no roadside parking.
As Mike also wrote use SIM money to pay the costs.
Where do you live on Solders pass road John? So cars park on Solders Pass Road…. I think the safety concerns/comments are way overblown if not outright fantasy’s . I’m mean the speed limit is only 25 MPH. Is it REALLY a question of safety ? Or are you just inconvienced. Especially since those newer NO PARKING signs are posted all over close by the trailhead. You want a real solution…. close the trailhead John. This way you won’t be inconvieced by people (both tourists and locals) doing something healthy and taking in the sights. ..
John Roberts..
For a guy who thinks he’s as smart as you . You sure do quote Mike quite a bit. “Well Mike said this or Mike said that” …. then you say “ which I agree with”
Why is that John, how come you can’t come up with your own ideas. and opinions .
That’s not the question the question is why should we do What you want?ll we have a city government that makes those decisions,not you and Mike . The city has rules and regulations mandated by codes City employees idiots just because they don’t fix your little problem that you knew about before you move there will not help .. visitors have rights too
Those 3/28 remarks a Sue Thomas offered above join the kind of comments the boys, Segner and Jones so often make in being snarky, oblivious of the facts, intentionally divergent and containing no intelligence . They all deserve being ignored as too stupid for specific responses. That’s the way it’ll be.
Why is that John Roberts?
Is that what you do when asked a direct question. You try to divert the question by your snarky remarks alluding that you are so intelligent?
I stand by my comment and once again I ask. Are you the John Roberts who frequently summarizes meetings that you weren’t even in attendance at.?
I think that your comments and others regarding safety concerns along Soldiers Pass rd are a bit overblown. If you don’t like cars parked on the shoulder cause it interferes with you peace of mind then say that. Your being disingenuous at best.
Sue good questions, I asked John” have there been accidents on that road? “ How many and what dates, all information available to the city . It’s simple it seem like a logical questionI, i also asked was the hiking trail there before he bought his home? If John wants us to believe and support his view he need to come up with some data John just calls them stupid questions..